[T3] (Fwd) 1969 Fastback Fuel pump

Sun Jun 7 12:22:08 PDT 2020

Thanks for the help. There is a click when turning the key to on, but is something other than fuel pump relay. If I place hand on relay there is nothing when the key is turned on.

Red wire to #30 is hot with 12V
Blue & white wire to #86 hot with 12V with key on
Grey or white wire is connected to #85
Red wire to #87 registers 0 V when key turned on

The above is with old relay and new relay

Connected direct power to pump, it turns on and appears to be working. I have not run test to see how much it pumps, but it turns on every time it has power.

Possibly replacement relay is bad?

Tim

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 28, 2020, at 10:13 AM, Jim Adney <jadney at vwtype3.org> wrote:
> 
> I'm forwarding this message from Tom Shiller who is a somewhat fresh Type 
> 3 owner having a problem with his '69. I'll post it here so he can take 
> advantage of everyone's input.
> 
> Hi Tom, and welcome to the Type 3 email list. '69 is a very nice year for 
> Type 3s; I love mine. Your story is pretty typical and it's likely that there's a 
> simple solution, or several simple solutions. Here are some things you can 
> check.
> 
> When you turn the key ON, you should hear a relay click under the dash and 
> then a second click about 1 second later. That's the fuel pump relay that's 
> screwed to the firewall just left of where the steering column exits. You can 
> repeat this as many times as you like, going from OFF to ON, but not to 
> START. Do you hear 2 clicks? If you're having trouble hearing, put your 
> hand on the relay so you can FEEL it click.
> 
> If you're getting 2 clicks, the fuel pump should run during that 1 second. You 
> may not be able to hear it from the driver's seat, so get a friend to listen with 
> their head near the top of the RF tire. They should hear a whirr from the 
> pump motor for 1 second each time you turn the key ON.  
> 
> If no motor sounds, make sure the battery is well charged. One of those 
> cheap Harbor Freight battery maintainers can be a good investment. Also 
> buy one of their cheap voltmeters. Play with the voltmeter until you think you 
> understand how to use it. Measuring a standard AA or D Cell is a good way 
> to practice.  
> 
> Set the voltmeter to a DC Voltage scale above 12 V and connect one wire to 
> a good ground and connect the other lead to the red wire that runs from the 
> fuel pump relay forward thru a hole in the firewall. That red wire, and the 
> brown wire that runs with it, feeds the fuel pump. The meter should register 
> some voltage during the 1 second that the relay is ON.
> 
> You can bypass the relay and energize the pump full time by shorting 
> between the 2 red wires on the fuel pump relay. You should get a small 
> spark when you do this; if you don't, that means there's a problem with the 
> wiring or inside the pump. There was a design flaw in the ground (brown) 
> wire routing in '68-9, so that could be part of your problem. I have a cheap kit 
> that fixes that problem, but there was a mid year change in '69, so I'll need 
> your VIN to sell you the right kit.
> 
> If none of this gets the pump to run, I can rebuild it as long as it's the later 
> style, with 3 parallel fuel hose ports. If it's the early style, with one port at 
> right angles to the other 2, I MAY be able to fix it. The early pumps are 
> completely different, but they seldom fail.
> 
> If your pump motor spins, but the engine still won't start, the problem could 
> still be inside the pump (motor spins, but pump doesn't pump.) I can fix that 
> common problem.
> 
> Let us know what you find and we'll go from there.
> 
> Jim
> 
> ------- Forwarded message follows -------
> 
> I just joined the VWType3.Org mailing list. Your email was mentioned on The 
> Samba a few times related to fuel pumps and I thought I would reach out for 
> help.
> 
> My 69 fastback was running fine and then started to sputter. It would then 
> start but when I tried to give it more fuel it would die. The tow truck driver 
> was very nice and I got home.
> 
> The car has sat for approximately 12 years indoors. It appears to be 
> unmolested with 1 couple owning for 35 years then selling to their mechanic 
> who had it for 15 years before I got it. I've probably put about 150 miles on 
> the car since I purchased.
> 
> I changed the fuel filter. No start and I can't hear the pump (not sure if I am 
> supposed to be able to hear it).
> I replaced the pump relay. No start and still can't hear the pump.
> I checked the #11 fuse and it appears good, but don't know if it could be bad 
> even though it doesn't look broken
> My next step would be to remove the fuel pump and test it.
> 
> Any suggestions would be welcomed. I am pretty new to the VW world, but 
> learning
> 
> Thanks in advance
> 
> Tim
> 
> 
> ------- End of forwarded message -------
> 
> -- 
> *******************************
> Jim Adney, jadney at vwtype3.org
> Madison, Wisconsin, USA
> *******************************
> 
> -------------- next part --------------
> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> Name: -
> Type: application/octet-stream
> Size: 1073 bytes
> Desc: not available
> URL: <http://lists.vwtype3.org/pipermail/type3-vwtype3.org/attachments/20200528/24cf2527/attachment.obj>
> -------------- next part --------------
> A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
> Name: -
> Type: application/octet-stream
> Size: 3138 bytes
> Desc: not available
> URL: <http://lists.vwtype3.org/pipermail/type3-vwtype3.org/attachments/20200528/24cf2527/attachment-0001.obj>
> _______________________________________________
> VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
> To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
> http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
> If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org