<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large">I don't know :( I suspect you are right about the lifters and/or camshaft. If the car does that same thing again after changing out the pushrods, we will take out the engine.</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large">BTW, Lloyd uses oil with "Z7" in it---he's got some stockpiled. We've been fanatical about doing oil changes.</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large">Lori</div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, May 21, 2014 at 1:58 PM, <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:type3-vwtype3.org-request@lists.vwtype3.org" target="_blank">type3-vwtype3.org-request@lists.vwtype3.org</a>></span> wrote:<br>
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Today's Topics:<br>
<br>
1. Re: <a href="http://type3-vwtype3.org" target="_blank">type3-vwtype3.org</a> Digest, Vol 44, Issue 25 (Jim Adney)<br>
2. Re: valve woes (Fiesta Cranberry)<br>
3. Re: valve woes (Daniel K. Du Vall)<br>
4. Re: valve woes (Daniel K. Du Vall)<br>
<br>
<br>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<br>
<br>
Message: 1<br>
Date: Wed, 21 May 2014 08:20:53 -0500<br>
From: "Jim Adney" <<a href="mailto:jadney@vwtype3.org">jadney@vwtype3.org</a>><br>
To: <a href="mailto:type3@vwtype3.org">type3@vwtype3.org</a><br>
Subject: Re: [T3] <a href="http://type3-vwtype3.org" target="_blank">type3-vwtype3.org</a> Digest, Vol 44, Issue 25<br>
Message-ID: <<a href="mailto:537CA835.10274.4BE467@jadney.vwtype3.org">537CA835.10274.4BE467@jadney.vwtype3.org</a>><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII<br>
<br>
On 21 May 2014 at 2:15, Fiesta Cranberry wrote:<br>
<br>
> We used Febi lifters, German made. Lloyd said he can see them thru the sump<br>
> hole, and they are OK. We used as many German made parts as we could.<br>
<br>
The lifters that failed on me were also German. They came wrapped in<br>
brown corrugated cardboard with a stamped notation "Made in W.<br>
Germany." They are known substandard parts. I do not recall seeing<br>
any brand markings on the package. I don't have much Febi experience,<br>
but what I have was poor. According to Berg, many years ago (so this<br>
could be different today) the only sources for good lifters are OEM<br>
VW (which could be Brazilian or Mexican) or the Brazilian ones<br>
marketed by T?? (sorry, can't remember the 3-letter brand this<br>
morning.) The T?? lifters are 3-piece parts that look the same on the<br>
outside but have a separate insert inside with a snap ring to hold it<br>
in place. They work the same, but are not recommended for hi-rev<br>
applications because sometimes the little snap rings work their way<br>
out and can actually weave their way thru the oil strainer and get<br>
caught up in the oil pump gears.<br>
<br>
Someone help me with the T?? brand. I'm just drawing a blank on this<br>
30 year old memory this morning. All I can think of is TDC....<br>
<br>
I suspect that the wear you've had here is too little to notice by<br>
looking thru the sump hole.<br>
<br>
For the record, I've always just reused my broken in OE camshafts.<br>
They may be worn a bit, but they have already been broken in and<br>
don't fail like this. I generally replace the lifters with new ones<br>
that I buy from Gene Berg.<br>
<br>
It's certainly possible that the problem is with the camshaft, but<br>
the distinction is moot since you have to crack the case to get to<br>
either of them. The problem is likely due to improper mating at the<br>
interface between the camshaft and lifter, and could be caused or<br>
made worse by the lack of ZDDP in the oil.<br>
<br>
ZDDP is an oil additive that is important for engines that have cams<br>
using flat lifters like ours, but ZDDP has been phased out of modern<br>
oils since it poisons catalytic converters. You can buy additives, or<br>
I buy Diesel (C-rated) oil that is also marked with an earlier S<br>
rating.<br>
<br>
This lubrication is most important during the break-in of the cam and<br>
lifter, as this is when the 2 surfaces are either going to work<br>
harden and survive, or start to wear down. It's probably very<br>
important with a refurbished cam.<br>
<br>
I'm afraid longer pushrods won't solve anything in your case; they<br>
only clear up the symptom. Longer or shorter pushrods are used to get<br>
the valve train back to the correct geometry when the heads have been<br>
moved in or out due to flycutting the combustion chamber or changing<br>
the crank to a longer stroke.<br>
<br>
--<br>
*******************************<br>
Jim Adney, <a href="mailto:jadney@vwtype3.org">jadney@vwtype3.org</a><br>
Madison, Wisconsin, USA<br>
*******************************<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
------------------------------<br>
<br>
Message: 2<br>
Date: Wed, 21 May 2014 12:45:37 -0700<br>
From: Fiesta Cranberry <<a href="mailto:fiestacranberry@gmail.com">fiestacranberry@gmail.com</a>><br>
To: <a href="mailto:type3-vwtype3.org@lists.vwtype3.org">type3-vwtype3.org@lists.vwtype3.org</a><br>
Subject: Re: [T3] valve woes<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<CAD=<a href="mailto:5u%2BL381UF5uVgkx7R-5HkUvRCMLnUUEzPNF6VqRnuEkN7oQ@mail.gmail.com">5u+L381UF5uVgkx7R-5HkUvRCMLnUUEzPNF6VqRnuEkN7oQ@mail.gmail.com</a>><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
?Very roughly (by eye), I would say the new pushrod is about 1/3 to 1/4<br>
> inch longer.<br>
><br>
<br>
?Lori?<br>
<br>
> ?<br>
><br>
><br>
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Message: 3<br>
Date: Wed, 21 May 2014 20:35:07 +0000<br>
From: "Daniel K. Du Vall" <<a href="mailto:dduvall@1peter4-10.org">dduvall@1peter4-10.org</a>><br>
To: "<a href="mailto:type3@vwtype3.org">type3@vwtype3.org</a>" <<a href="mailto:type3@vwtype3.org">type3@vwtype3.org</a>>,<br>
"<a href="mailto:type3-vwtype3.org@lists.vwtype3.org">type3-vwtype3.org@lists.vwtype3.org</a>"<br>
<<a href="mailto:type3-vwtype3.org@lists.vwtype3.org">type3-vwtype3.org@lists.vwtype3.org</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [T3] valve woes<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<<a href="mailto:370d5ba9a5794bdbbe5c431ab6bb4efc@BY2PR05MB109.namprd05.prod.outlook.com">370d5ba9a5794bdbbe5c431ab6bb4efc@BY2PR05MB109.namprd05.prod.outlook.com</a>><br>
<br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
Well that probably rules out my thoughts. I was thinking possibly the head bolts pulling out if there had not been case savers put in during the rebuild. But that much sure seems like cam and lifter failure or the pushrod ends not being seated in the tubes properly. That?s a lot of change though. I assume that the valve adjusters were not coming loose?<br>
<br>
Daniel Du Vall<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: <a href="http://type3-vwtype3.org" target="_blank">type3-vwtype3.org</a> [mailto:<a href="mailto:type3-vwtype3.org-bounces@lists.vwtype3.org">type3-vwtype3.org-bounces@lists.vwtype3.org</a>] On Behalf Of Fiesta Cranberry<br>
Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2014 2:46 PM<br>
To: <a href="mailto:type3-vwtype3.org@lists.vwtype3.org">type3-vwtype3.org@lists.vwtype3.org</a><br>
Subject: Re: [T3] valve woes<br>
<br>
?Very roughly (by eye), I would say the new pushrod is about 1/3 to 1/4<br>
> inch longer.<br>
><br>
<br>
?Lori?<br>
<br>
> ?<br>
><br>
><br>
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Message: 4<br>
Date: Wed, 21 May 2014 20:35:07 +0000<br>
From: "Daniel K. Du Vall" <<a href="mailto:dduvall@1peter4-10.org">dduvall@1peter4-10.org</a>><br>
To: "<a href="mailto:type3@vwtype3.org">type3@vwtype3.org</a>" <<a href="mailto:type3@vwtype3.org">type3@vwtype3.org</a>>,<br>
"<a href="mailto:type3-vwtype3.org@lists.vwtype3.org">type3-vwtype3.org@lists.vwtype3.org</a>"<br>
<<a href="mailto:type3-vwtype3.org@lists.vwtype3.org">type3-vwtype3.org@lists.vwtype3.org</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [T3] valve woes<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<<a href="mailto:370d5ba9a5794bdbbe5c431ab6bb4efc@BY2PR05MB109.namprd05.prod.outlook.com">370d5ba9a5794bdbbe5c431ab6bb4efc@BY2PR05MB109.namprd05.prod.outlook.com</a>><br>
<br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
Well that probably rules out my thoughts. I was thinking possibly the head bolts pulling out if there had not been case savers put in during the rebuild. But that much sure seems like cam and lifter failure or the pushrod ends not being seated in the tubes properly. That?s a lot of change though. I assume that the valve adjusters were not coming loose?<br>
<br>
Daniel Du Vall<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: <a href="http://type3-vwtype3.org" target="_blank">type3-vwtype3.org</a> [mailto:<a href="mailto:type3-vwtype3.org-bounces@lists.vwtype3.org">type3-vwtype3.org-bounces@lists.vwtype3.org</a>] On Behalf Of Fiesta Cranberry<br>
Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2014 2:46 PM<br>
To: <a href="mailto:type3-vwtype3.org@lists.vwtype3.org">type3-vwtype3.org@lists.vwtype3.org</a><br>
Subject: Re: [T3] valve woes<br>
<br>
?Very roughly (by eye), I would say the new pushrod is about 1/3 to 1/4<br>
> inch longer.<br>
><br>
<br>
?Lori?<br>
<br>
> ?<br>
><br>
><br>
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End of <a href="http://type3-vwtype3.org" target="_blank">type3-vwtype3.org</a> Digest, Vol 44, Issue 27<br>
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</blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br>"I wrestled with reality for 36 years, and I'm happy to say I've finally won out over it."<br> ---Elwood P. Dowd<br>
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