[T3] type 4 2000cc oil pressure and overheating problem

Keith Park topnotch at nycap.rr.com
Fri Dec 9 20:41:37 PST 2011

Well, I went with a 2056 because as you say, if it can push a bloated brick
thru the air at 70mph and perform like a porsche in a rollerskate it ought
to be loafing in the back of a Squareback.

However, after building TWO 2056's under the guidance of Jake Raby I found
that I could put the mixture wherever I wanted, and that's easy to do with
Djet, and it would always run within about 5 degrees of 240 on the highway
at 70MPH in the summer after about a half hour. We went thru the cooling
system, the FI setup, the oil pump... everything, but no way no how would it
run cooler than that in the Squareback.

Additionally, I found that at 3400RPM it would suck the sump nearly dry with
the stock baffle in place, and on the second engine with the baffle removed
it frothed the oil to the point of losing 20PSI of oil pressure on the
highway under the same conditions.

The final conclusion was that the T3 engine is the ONLY one that uses a 2
stage cooling fan, and that's because you don't get forced induction in a
Square or Fasty and the single stage fan on the T4 will not "pull" the air
in properly, my heads were always cool but the Oil was the problem under any
mixture I tried.

Without the instrumentation however, the average person would be totally
unaware of any of this except maybe for a flickering oil light at idle when
coming off the highway, which you of course shouldn't have with a new
engine.  The T4 is indeed durable, and I don't really know how long it would
last running under these conditions but Jake agreed that it shouldn't be run
that hot and I need to pull a boat with this thing in the summer so things
would only get worse...

Jake did have this problem with cooling in a Thing application once and he
cured it by changing the air intake to force cooling induction, there is
really no way I can do that to my car without hacking things up, which im
not willing to do.

I may try this once again with the baffle back in place, an extra oil sump
and an auxillary oil cooler but Im still not sure if I want to deal with
having to use high test gas and get 21MPG on the highway with todays gas


Top Notch Restorations
topnotch at nycap.rr.com 
71 Squareback "Hothe"
65 Notchback "El Baja Rojo"
65 Squareback "Eggcrate"
87 golf "Winterat"
93 RX7 "Redstur"

-----Original Message-----
From: type3-vwtype3.org-bounces at lists.vwtype3.org
[mailto:type3-vwtype3.org-bounces at lists.vwtype3.org] On Behalf Of Jonathan
Sent: Friday, December 09, 2011 11:13 PM
To: type3 at vwtype3.org
Subject: Re: [T3] type 4 2000cc oil pressure and overheating problem


In what application is the Type 4 so fragile? In a Type 3? Not in a Type 2
or Porsche application that is for sure.

Type 4 motors are incredibly robust and durable. Their cooling systems are
night and day next to a conventional Type 1 setup, and very similar to the
type 3.

Case-in-point. I had one wacky guy named "J. Dizzle" come into my shop in a
late model Campmobile ('79 if I recall). He had some shifting problems
after driving cross country from New York He was towing a trailer with a
Harley loaded into it. His Campmobile was fully loaded in typical Rainbow
Gathering style.

He had no engine seal, 5 pieces of tin were missing, no heat deflector
plate, multiple exhaust leaks and....(read closely)...he had replaced his
alternator with a Harbor Freight Generator. This is not a joke. The
generator was mounted in the back of the bus behind an acrylic panel and
was running at full power, supplying voltage to a battery charger which was
in turn hooked to the battery.

Completely nuts.

After fixing his separated shifting cage he went merrily on his way.

He made the same trip twice more without changing a thing.

This anecdote isn't to encourage foolishness and he defiantly got lucky.
But Type 4 motors really don't have a overheating problem at all. They just
need to be tuned, just like any other car. They do have pretty wide
margins, so if you are overheating, something is pretty wrong.

In my experience, it usually isn't just one thing. It is usually a perfect
storm of sorts when folks start noticing problems. Most customers will
bring in a Type 4 bus for a "small problem" and discover sometimes dozens
of issues that are contributing the the symptoms. The T4 just runs and runs
and runs. After I fix the issues the most common response it always, "I
never knew these buses had so much power!". Yep, VW designed the motor to
push 2 tons of flat sided beef around. They knew what they were doing. :)

But this is a Type 3 list, so I'll try to keep in learning mode and keep
the focus there. I like this list. Type 3 folks like to get their rigs set
up correctly and honor the brand. And kudos to the atmosphere. It is warm
and inviting with good accurate knowledge and to the point.


On Fri, Dec 9, 2011 at 6:39 PM, Keith Park <topnotch at nycap.rr.com> wrote:

> Welcome to the world of the T4!
> Even the slightest of problems will cause them to overheat, you have to
> start by getting and AFR meter on it so you know where your mixture is.
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