[T3] Oil...

B Fye vwfye311 at gmail.com
Sat Sep 16 18:16:03 PDT 2017


I use whatever is on sale.  10w-30 conventional on sale.  Currently, that
is Carquest brand oil.

Some will scoff, but I have never wiped out a cam in any of my engines.

Brian

On Sep 16, 2017 6:11 PM, <type3-vwtype3.org-request at lists.vwtype3.org>
wrote:

Send type3-vwtype3.org mailing list submissions to
        type3-vwtype3.org at lists.vwtype3.org

To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
        http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
        type3-vwtype3.org-request at lists.vwtype3.org

You can reach the person managing the list at
        type3-vwtype3.org-owner at lists.vwtype3.org

When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of type3-vwtype3.org digest..."


***********************************
When replying to the digest, please remember to trim your message. Thanks!
:)
***********************************


_______________________________________________
VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org
_______________________________________________



Today's Topics:

   1. Re: Engine Oil (Phil Hof)
   2. Knock Knock (Daniel Nohejl)
   3. Re: Knock Knock (Sean Bartnik)
   4. Re: Engine Oil (Keith Park)
   5. Re: Knock Knock (Ralph Tree)
   6. Re: Knock Knock (Dave Hall)
   7. Re: Knock Knock (Keith Park)
   8. Re: Knock Knock (Sean Bartnik)
   9. Re: Knock Knock (Keith Park)
  10. Re: Knock Knock (Keith Park)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2017 15:04:11 -0700
From: Phil Hof <phil.hof at ostronic.org>
To: type3-vwtype3.org at lists.vwtype3.org
Subject: Re: [T3] Engine Oil
Message-ID: <EAA6940D-9CFF-43E7-AB64-1FC044266AEC at ostronic.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8

There are literally hundreds of pages on oil in the Samba!  One more voice,
FWIW?

My rebuilder recommended VR-1 30 weight after he rebuilt the long block.
With the damage I probably did driving to/from the Invasion, I found I had
low oil pressure when hot, so I went to 20W-50 (and the racing oil at that,
for the high temp tolerance).  Plus 4oz ZDDP additive at oil changes, per
his recommendation.

Along with replacing my broken distributor (that had been WAY over
advancing on that trip), this seems to have brought my pressures and
temperatures where they need to be.  I may have done damage, because at my
oil change this morning, I found light metal flakes caught by the screen (I
also have a spin-on full flow filter, which I may cut open one of these
days).

My fingers are crossed for the Type 3 Rally up the SoCal coast at the end
of this month.  After that, I may pull the motor and split the case to find
what I chewed up.

That oil and additive are expensive, and I change it by the calendar, not
the odometer, since I drive maybe a couple of thousand miles a year at most
(save for the Invasion and Rally).

-Phil

> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2017 10:44:13 -0500
> From: Gary Forsmo <gbforsmo at gmail.com>
> To: "type3 at vwtype3.org" <type3 at vwtype3.org>
> Subject: [T3] Engine Oil
> Message-ID:
>       <CAN8eaV_5znmpPXMcy3Xc3Wf2yRj_dmPmZSCg7vY6TeCA+OipPA at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Within our Type 3 group, what engine oil is popular?
>
>   1. Price per quart or
>   2. 12-quart case?
>
>
> Do any of you insist on using an engine oil which either has
>
>   1. Zinc dialkyldithiophosphate (ZDDP) *IN* the oil or
>   2. do you *add* approximately 4 oz. of ZDDP, when you change your oil?
>
> I have periodically used Valvoline VR1 10W-30 Racing Oil and Amsoil Z-Rod
> 10W-30.  Both are quite expensive.
>
> Are those oils worth the expense, given most of us drive a few hundred or
a
> few thousand miles a year?
> ************************************************



------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2017 18:51:07 -0400
From: Daniel Nohejl <d.nohejl at gmail.com>
To: "type3 at vwtype3.org" <type3 at vwtype3.org>
Subject: [T3] Knock Knock
Message-ID: <B29FEEDF-DBD5-4170-A43A-09C1EFF1FF66 at gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8

Over the last few weeks, we?ve been trying to diagnose a noise?...

In Madison, I thought I noticed what sounded like a loose valve. A day or
so later, we discovered that the connection between our heater box and
muffler was loose. We tightened it and applied some muffler repair and the
noise vanished. Now, we have a new louder noise that has emerged over the
last few weeks. It?s been hard to diagnose as the noise is generally
loudest at cold start and for the 10 or 15 seconds the engine is running
before the high idle kicks in. To properly diagnose, I had to pinch off the
AAR hose at the air cleaner so I could get a low idle for a longer period.
I also required the assistance of Sean, whose ear has proven indispensable
more than once. Anyway, here are the other general characteristics of the
noise:

1. The noise is loudest at idle
2. Above idle, it sounds like a loose valve.
3. While cruising, it can barely be heard, even when driving next to a
concrete divider on the highway.
4. After letting off the gas, the noise doesn?t return until just above
idle. It definitely doesn?t start up right after getting off the throttle.
5. It?s clearly coming from the 3/4 side of the motor.
6. All valves are correctly set, there?s no excessive side play (solid
rocker shafts), the springs are fine, etc. I?ve run the motor several times
with the valve cover off and everything looks right.
7. After unplugging the spark plug wires at #3 and #4, it?s clear that the
issue is at #3. With the #3 wire unplugged, the noise diminishes by a good
80%

Here?s a video (credit Sean) that does a great job of capturing the noise

https://youtu.be/sxs1yrFLPl0

I know what all of this suggests, but I?m curious if what I?m describing
rings any other bells for anyone. Or, if we know what it is, can it be
fixed without splitting the case????

Thanks,

Daniel




------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2017 19:14:26 -0400
From: Sean Bartnik <sjbartnik at mac.com>
To: type3 at vwtype3.org
Subject: Re: [T3] Knock Knock
Message-ID: <626CAB83-9620-4D91-B906-4CBCD8A101A4 at mac.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8

Just to add my impression since the character of the noise doesn?t always
come across in video (though I think this one does a good job).

It?s a very metallic hammering type sound.  Sounds deep; not like valve
noise.


> On Sep 16, 2017, at 6:51 PM, Daniel Nohejl <d.nohejl at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Over the last few weeks, we?ve been trying to diagnose a noise?...
>
> In Madison, I thought I noticed what sounded like a loose valve. A day or
so later, we discovered that the connection between our heater box and
muffler was loose. We tightened it and applied some muffler repair and the
noise vanished. Now, we have a new louder noise that has emerged over the
last few weeks. It?s been hard to diagnose as the noise is generally
loudest at cold start and for the 10 or 15 seconds the engine is running
before the high idle kicks in. To properly diagnose, I had to pinch off the
AAR hose at the air cleaner so I could get a low idle for a longer period.
I also required the assistance of Sean, whose ear has proven indispensable
more than once. Anyway, here are the other general characteristics of the
noise:
>
> 1. The noise is loudest at idle
> 2. Above idle, it sounds like a loose valve.
> 3. While cruising, it can barely be heard, even when driving next to a
concrete divider on the highway.
> 4. After letting off the gas, the noise doesn?t return until just above
idle. It definitely doesn?t start up right after getting off the throttle.
> 5. It?s clearly coming from the 3/4 side of the motor.
> 6. All valves are correctly set, there?s no excessive side play (solid
rocker shafts), the springs are fine, etc. I?ve run the motor several times
with the valve cover off and everything looks right.
> 7. After unplugging the spark plug wires at #3 and #4, it?s clear that
the issue is at #3. With the #3 wire unplugged, the noise diminishes by a
good 80%
>
> Here?s a video (credit Sean) that does a great job of capturing the noise
>
> https://youtu.be/sxs1yrFLPl0
>
> I know what all of this suggests, but I?m curious if what I?m describing
rings any other bells for anyone. Or, if we know what it is, can it be
fixed without splitting the case????
>
> Thanks,
>
> Daniel
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
> To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
> http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
> If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org



------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2017 20:38:37 -0400
From: "Keith Park" <topnotch at nycap.rr.com>
To: <type3 at vwtype3.org>
Subject: Re: [T3] Engine Oil
Message-ID: <C1.87.26203.704CDB95 at cdptpa-omsmta01>
Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="us-ascii"

I use Pennzoil 25W50 racing oil in the square with its old engine, in summer
use, it has the ZDDP.  In the Notch I use Joe Gibbs, forget what type,
but its for the air cooleds and has the ZDDP.  10W30 as the engine is young
and tight.  Remember, synthetics cant be used in stock engines without the
oil filter.

Keith


Topnotch Restorations
topnotch at nycap.rr.com
http://www.a383ina68.addr.com/radiorest/main.htm
71 Squareback  "Hothe"
65 Notchback  "El Baja Rojo"
93 RX7  "Redstur"
87 Golf  "Winterat" RIP
01 Sentra SE "Boremobile"

-----Original Message-----
From: type3-vwtype3.org [mailto:type3-vwtype3.org-bounces at lists.vwtype3.org]
On Behalf Of Gary Forsmo
Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2017 11:44 AM
To: type3 at vwtype3.org
Subject: [T3] Engine Oil

Within our Type 3 group, what engine oil is popular?

   1. Price per quart or
   2. 12-quart case?


Do any of you insist on using an engine oil which either has

   1. Zinc dialkyldithiophosphate (ZDDP) *IN* the oil or
   2. do you *add* approximately 4 oz. of ZDDP, when you change your oil?

I have periodically used Valvoline VR1 10W-30 Racing Oil and Amsoil Z-Rod
10W-30.  Both are quite expensive.

Are those oils worth the expense, given most of us drive a few hundred or a
few thousand miles a year?


--
Gary "Frito" - '69 Squareback, FI, MT, One-owner
Rockport, TX (winter)
Lake Geneva, WI (summer)
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL:
<http://lists.vwtype3.org/pipermail/type3-vwtype3.org/attachments/20170916/8
c4686dc/attachment.htm>
_______________________________________________
VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org



------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2017 18:42:23 -0600
From: Ralph Tree <treedog12001 at yahoo.com>
To: type3 at vwtype3.org
Subject: Re: [T3] Knock Knock
Message-ID: <37E0FC57-B965-4A9D-BA7A-2B5CED60A9EF at yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;       charset=utf-8

I had heard before, that you shouldn't use synthetic oils in the Aircooled
engines. I was just curious as to why.
Thanks
Ralph Tree

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 16, 2017, at 5:14 PM, Sean Bartnik <sjbartnik at mac.com> wrote:
>
> Just to add my impression since the character of the noise doesn?t always
come across in video (though I think this one does a good job).
>
> It?s a very metallic hammering type sound.  Sounds deep; not like valve
noise.
>
>
>> On Sep 16, 2017, at 6:51 PM, Daniel Nohejl <d.nohejl at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Over the last few weeks, we?ve been trying to diagnose a noise?...
>>
>> In Madison, I thought I noticed what sounded like a loose valve. A day
or so later, we discovered that the connection between our heater box and
muffler was loose. We tightened it and applied some muffler repair and the
noise vanished. Now, we have a new louder noise that has emerged over the
last few weeks. It?s been hard to diagnose as the noise is generally
loudest at cold start and for the 10 or 15 seconds the engine is running
before the high idle kicks in. To properly diagnose, I had to pinch off the
AAR hose at the air cleaner so I could get a low idle for a longer period.
I also required the assistance of Sean, whose ear has proven indispensable
more than once. Anyway, here are the other general characteristics of the
noise:
>>
>> 1. The noise is loudest at idle
>> 2. Above idle, it sounds like a loose valve.
>> 3. While cruising, it can barely be heard, even when driving next to a
concrete divider on the highway.
>> 4. After letting off the gas, the noise doesn?t return until just above
idle. It definitely doesn?t start up right after getting off the throttle.
>> 5. It?s clearly coming from the 3/4 side of the motor.
>> 6. All valves are correctly set, there?s no excessive side play (solid
rocker shafts), the springs are fine, etc. I?ve run the motor several times
with the valve cover off and everything looks right.
>> 7. After unplugging the spark plug wires at #3 and #4, it?s clear that
the issue is at #3. With the #3 wire unplugged, the noise diminishes by a
good 80%
>>
>> Here?s a video (credit Sean) that does a great job of capturing the noise
>>
>> https://youtu.be/sxs1yrFLPl0
>>
>> I know what all of this suggests, but I?m curious if what I?m describing
rings any other bells for anyone. Or, if we know what it is, can it be
fixed without splitting the case????
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Daniel
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
>> To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
>> http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
>> If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
> To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
> http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
> If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org



------------------------------

Message: 6
Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2017 01:45:25 +0100
From: "Dave Hall" <dave at hallvw.clara.co.uk>
To: <type3 at vwtype3.org>
Subject: Re: [T3] Knock Knock
Message-ID: <09C957F1DAEA428C8C75409B0B661636 at DavidPC>
Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="us-ascii"

That sounds just like the worn cam I had on my 30hp Beetle engine. On that
the push-rods could be taken out as a single piece with the cam followers,
and one cam had worn the followers concave, through to the internal oilways.
If it's a worn cam, and/or follower, you'll have to split the case to fix
it.

I hope I'm wrong!

Dave
UK VW Type 3&4 Club
===================

-----Original Message-----
From: type3-vwtype3.org [mailto:type3-vwtype3.org-bounces at lists.vwtype3.org]
On Behalf Of Daniel Nohejl
Sent: 16 September 2017 23:51
To: type3 at vwtype3.org
Subject: [T3] Knock Knock

Over the last few weeks, we've been trying to diagnose a noise....

In Madison, I thought I noticed what sounded like a loose valve. A day or so
later, we discovered that the connection between our heater box and muffler
was loose. We tightened it and applied some muffler repair and the noise
vanished. Now, we have a new louder noise that has emerged over the last few
weeks. It's been hard to diagnose as the noise is generally loudest at cold
start and for the 10 or 15 seconds the engine is running before the high
idle kicks in. To properly diagnose, I had to pinch off the AAR hose at the
air cleaner so I could get a low idle for a longer period. I also required
the assistance of Sean, whose ear has proven indispensable more than once.
Anyway, here are the other general characteristics of the noise:

1. The noise is loudest at idle
2. Above idle, it sounds like a loose valve.
3. While cruising, it can barely be heard, even when driving next to a
concrete divider on the highway.
4. After letting off the gas, the noise doesn't return until just above
idle. It definitely doesn't start up right after getting off the throttle.
5. It's clearly coming from the 3/4 side of the motor.
6. All valves are correctly set, there's no excessive side play (solid
rocker shafts), the springs are fine, etc. I've run the motor several times
with the valve cover off and everything looks right.
7. After unplugging the spark plug wires at #3 and #4, it's clear that the
issue is at #3. With the #3 wire unplugged, the noise diminishes by a good
80%

Here's a video (credit Sean) that does a great job of capturing the noise

https://youtu.be/sxs1yrFLPl0

I know what all of this suggests, but I'm curious if what I'm describing
rings any other bells for anyone. Or, if we know what it is, can it be fixed
without splitting the case????

Thanks,

Daniel


_______________________________________________
VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org To unsubscribe or change
subscription options, visit:
http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org


---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus



------------------------------

Message: 7
Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2017 20:52:57 -0400
From: "Keith Park" <topnotch at nycap.rr.com>
To: <type3 at vwtype3.org>
Subject: Re: [T3] Knock Knock
Message-ID: <2D.5D.12431.267CDB95 at cdptpa-omsmta03>
Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="us-ascii"

that sounds like valve train, it doesnt change as the oil pressure comes up
so it isnt a pressure fed bearing.

Keith


Topnotch Restorations
topnotch at nycap.rr.com
http://www.a383ina68.addr.com/radiorest/main.htm
71 Squareback  "Hothe"
65 Notchback  "El Baja Rojo"
93 RX7  "Redstur"
87 Golf  "Winterat" RIP
01 Sentra SE "Boremobile"


-----Original Message-----
From: type3-vwtype3.org [mailto:type3-vwtype3.org-bounces at lists.vwtype3.org]
On Behalf Of Sean Bartnik
Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2017 7:14 PM
To: type3 at vwtype3.org
Subject: Re: [T3] Knock Knock

Just to add my impression since the character of the noise doesn't always
come across in video (though I think this one does a good job).

It's a very metallic hammering type sound.  Sounds deep; not like valve
noise.


> On Sep 16, 2017, at 6:51 PM, Daniel Nohejl <d.nohejl at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Over the last few weeks, we've been trying to diagnose a noise....
>
> In Madison, I thought I noticed what sounded like a loose valve. A day or
so later, we discovered that the connection between our heater box and
muffler was loose. We tightened it and applied some muffler repair and the
noise vanished. Now, we have a new louder noise that has emerged over the
last few weeks. It's been hard to diagnose as the noise is generally loudest
at cold start and for the 10 or 15 seconds the engine is running before the
high idle kicks in. To properly diagnose, I had to pinch off the AAR hose at
the air cleaner so I could get a low idle for a longer period. I also
required the assistance of Sean, whose ear has proven indispensable more
than once. Anyway, here are the other general characteristics of the noise:
>
> 1. The noise is loudest at idle
> 2. Above idle, it sounds like a loose valve.
> 3. While cruising, it can barely be heard, even when driving next to a
concrete divider on the highway.
> 4. After letting off the gas, the noise doesn't return until just above
idle. It definitely doesn't start up right after getting off the throttle.
> 5. It's clearly coming from the 3/4 side of the motor.
> 6. All valves are correctly set, there's no excessive side play (solid
rocker shafts), the springs are fine, etc. I've run the motor several times
with the valve cover off and everything looks right.
> 7. After unplugging the spark plug wires at #3 and #4, it's clear that the
issue is at #3. With the #3 wire unplugged, the noise diminishes by a good
80%
>
> Here's a video (credit Sean) that does a great job of capturing the noise
>
> https://youtu.be/sxs1yrFLPl0
>
> I know what all of this suggests, but I'm curious if what I'm describing
rings any other bells for anyone. Or, if we know what it is, can it be fixed
without splitting the case????
>
> Thanks,
>
> Daniel
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
> To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
> http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
> If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org

_______________________________________________
VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org



------------------------------

Message: 8
Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2017 21:01:03 -0400
From: Sean Bartnik <sjbartnik at mac.com>
To: type3 at vwtype3.org
Subject: Re: [T3] Knock Knock
Message-ID: <F6148D39-2AE5-42CA-85CA-94DD00FBFD8E at mac.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Actually it does change as the pressure comes up, it gets quieter when
engine speed is increased.

-Sean

> On Sep 16, 2017, at 8:52 PM, Keith Park <topnotch at nycap.rr.com> wrote:
>
> that sounds like valve train, it doesnt change as the oil pressure comes
up
> so it isnt a pressure fed bearing.
>
> Keith
>
>
> Topnotch Restorations
> topnotch at nycap.rr.com
> http://www.a383ina68.addr.com/radiorest/main.htm
> 71 Squareback  "Hothe"
> 65 Notchback  "El Baja Rojo"
> 93 RX7  "Redstur"
> 87 Golf  "Winterat" RIP
> 01 Sentra SE "Boremobile"
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: type3-vwtype3.org [mailto:type3-vwtype3.org-
bounces at lists.vwtype3.org]
> On Behalf Of Sean Bartnik
> Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2017 7:14 PM
> To: type3 at vwtype3.org
> Subject: Re: [T3] Knock Knock
>
> Just to add my impression since the character of the noise doesn't always
> come across in video (though I think this one does a good job).
>
> It's a very metallic hammering type sound.  Sounds deep; not like valve
> noise.
>
>
>> On Sep 16, 2017, at 6:51 PM, Daniel Nohejl <d.nohejl at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Over the last few weeks, we've been trying to diagnose a noise....
>>
>> In Madison, I thought I noticed what sounded like a loose valve. A day or
> so later, we discovered that the connection between our heater box and
> muffler was loose. We tightened it and applied some muffler repair and the
> noise vanished. Now, we have a new louder noise that has emerged over the
> last few weeks. It's been hard to diagnose as the noise is generally
loudest
> at cold start and for the 10 or 15 seconds the engine is running before
the
> high idle kicks in. To properly diagnose, I had to pinch off the AAR hose
at
> the air cleaner so I could get a low idle for a longer period. I also
> required the assistance of Sean, whose ear has proven indispensable more
> than once. Anyway, here are the other general characteristics of the
noise:
>>
>> 1. The noise is loudest at idle
>> 2. Above idle, it sounds like a loose valve.
>> 3. While cruising, it can barely be heard, even when driving next to a
> concrete divider on the highway.
>> 4. After letting off the gas, the noise doesn't return until just above
> idle. It definitely doesn't start up right after getting off the throttle.
>> 5. It's clearly coming from the 3/4 side of the motor.
>> 6. All valves are correctly set, there's no excessive side play (solid
> rocker shafts), the springs are fine, etc. I've run the motor several
times
> with the valve cover off and everything looks right.
>> 7. After unplugging the spark plug wires at #3 and #4, it's clear that
the
> issue is at #3. With the #3 wire unplugged, the noise diminishes by a good
> 80%
>>
>> Here's a video (credit Sean) that does a great job of capturing the noise
>>
>> https://youtu.be/sxs1yrFLPl0
>>
>> I know what all of this suggests, but I'm curious if what I'm describing
> rings any other bells for anyone. Or, if we know what it is, can it be
fixed
> without splitting the case????
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Daniel
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
>> To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
>> http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
>> If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
> To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
> http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
> If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
> To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
> http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
> If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org


------------------------------

Message: 9
Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2017 21:08:15 -0400
From: "Keith Park" <topnotch at nycap.rr.com>
To: <type3 at vwtype3.org>
Subject: Re: [T3] Knock Knock
Message-ID: <11.82.12431.9FACDB95 at cdptpa-omsmta03>
Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="us-ascii"

Synthetics transfer heat at a different rate, making for problem
moving heat from the heads to the sump and other places, my notch
runs 20F hotter with Synthetics.  The other problem is they have a
high detergent quality with contaminants, and without an oil filter keep
circulating what was once neatly stored sludges thru your bearings again and
again.

Amzoil destroyed my last engine in less that 400 miles.  Amzoil is
different than most synthetics.

My current engine has 160K on it with nothing but Dino oils,
and its still going strong.  I cant complain about that!

Keith


Topnotch Restorations
topnotch at nycap.rr.com
http://www.a383ina68.addr.com/radiorest/main.htm
71 Squareback  "Hothe"
65 Notchback  "El Baja Rojo"
93 RX7  "Redstur"
87 Golf  "Winterat" RIP
01 Sentra SE "Boremobile"


-----Original Message-----
From: type3-vwtype3.org [mailto:type3-vwtype3.org-bounces at lists.vwtype3.org]
On Behalf Of Ralph Tree
Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2017 8:42 PM
To: type3 at vwtype3.org
Subject: Re: [T3] Knock Knock

I had heard before, that you shouldn't use synthetic oils in the Aircooled
engines. I was just curious as to why.
Thanks
Ralph Tree

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 16, 2017, at 5:14 PM, Sean Bartnik <sjbartnik at mac.com> wrote:
>
> Just to add my impression since the character of the noise doesn't always
come across in video (though I think this one does a good job).
>
> It's a very metallic hammering type sound.  Sounds deep; not like valve
noise.
>
>
>> On Sep 16, 2017, at 6:51 PM, Daniel Nohejl <d.nohejl at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Over the last few weeks, we've been trying to diagnose a noise....
>>
>> In Madison, I thought I noticed what sounded like a loose valve. A day or
so later, we discovered that the connection between our heater box and
muffler was loose. We tightened it and applied some muffler repair and the
noise vanished. Now, we have a new louder noise that has emerged over the
last few weeks. It's been hard to diagnose as the noise is generally loudest
at cold start and for the 10 or 15 seconds the engine is running before the
high idle kicks in. To properly diagnose, I had to pinch off the AAR hose at
the air cleaner so I could get a low idle for a longer period. I also
required the assistance of Sean, whose ear has proven indispensable more
than once. Anyway, here are the other general characteristics of the noise:
>>
>> 1. The noise is loudest at idle
>> 2. Above idle, it sounds like a loose valve.
>> 3. While cruising, it can barely be heard, even when driving next to a
concrete divider on the highway.
>> 4. After letting off the gas, the noise doesn't return until just above
idle. It definitely doesn't start up right after getting off the throttle.
>> 5. It's clearly coming from the 3/4 side of the motor.
>> 6. All valves are correctly set, there's no excessive side play (solid
rocker shafts), the springs are fine, etc. I've run the motor several times
with the valve cover off and everything looks right.
>> 7. After unplugging the spark plug wires at #3 and #4, it's clear that
the issue is at #3. With the #3 wire unplugged, the noise diminishes by a
good 80%
>>
>> Here's a video (credit Sean) that does a great job of capturing the noise
>>
>> https://youtu.be/sxs1yrFLPl0
>>
>> I know what all of this suggests, but I'm curious if what I'm describing
rings any other bells for anyone. Or, if we know what it is, can it be fixed
without splitting the case????
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Daniel
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
>> To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
>> http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
>> If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
> To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
> http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
> If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org

_______________________________________________
VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org



------------------------------

Message: 10
Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2017 21:10:25 -0400
From: "Keith Park" <topnotch at nycap.rr.com>
To: <type3 at vwtype3.org>
Subject: Re: [T3] Knock Knock
Message-ID: <69.31.26203.A7BCDB95 at cdptpa-omsmta01>
Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="us-ascii"

what I heard missed a couple beats on startup, but didnt get quieter,
and the engine never exceeded idle, is there another video im missing?

Keith


Topnotch Restorations
topnotch at nycap.rr.com
http://www.a383ina68.addr.com/radiorest/main.htm
71 Squareback  "Hothe"
65 Notchback  "El Baja Rojo"
93 RX7  "Redstur"
87 Golf  "Winterat" RIP
01 Sentra SE "Boremobile"


-----Original Message-----
From: type3-vwtype3.org [mailto:type3-vwtype3.org-bounces at lists.vwtype3.org]
On Behalf Of Sean Bartnik
Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2017 9:01 PM
To: type3 at vwtype3.org
Subject: Re: [T3] Knock Knock

Actually it does change as the pressure comes up, it gets quieter when
engine speed is increased.

-Sean

> On Sep 16, 2017, at 8:52 PM, Keith Park <topnotch at nycap.rr.com> wrote:
>
> that sounds like valve train, it doesnt change as the oil pressure comes
up
> so it isnt a pressure fed bearing.
>
> Keith
>
>
> Topnotch Restorations
> topnotch at nycap.rr.com
> http://www.a383ina68.addr.com/radiorest/main.htm
> 71 Squareback  "Hothe"
> 65 Notchback  "El Baja Rojo"
> 93 RX7  "Redstur"
> 87 Golf  "Winterat" RIP
> 01 Sentra SE "Boremobile"
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: type3-vwtype3.org
[mailto:type3-vwtype3.org-bounces at lists.vwtype3.org]
> On Behalf Of Sean Bartnik
> Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2017 7:14 PM
> To: type3 at vwtype3.org
> Subject: Re: [T3] Knock Knock
>
> Just to add my impression since the character of the noise doesn't always
> come across in video (though I think this one does a good job).
>
> It's a very metallic hammering type sound.  Sounds deep; not like valve
> noise.
>
>
>> On Sep 16, 2017, at 6:51 PM, Daniel Nohejl <d.nohejl at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Over the last few weeks, we've been trying to diagnose a noise....
>>
>> In Madison, I thought I noticed what sounded like a loose valve. A day or
> so later, we discovered that the connection between our heater box and
> muffler was loose. We tightened it and applied some muffler repair and the
> noise vanished. Now, we have a new louder noise that has emerged over the
> last few weeks. It's been hard to diagnose as the noise is generally
loudest
> at cold start and for the 10 or 15 seconds the engine is running before
the
> high idle kicks in. To properly diagnose, I had to pinch off the AAR hose
at
> the air cleaner so I could get a low idle for a longer period. I also
> required the assistance of Sean, whose ear has proven indispensable more
> than once. Anyway, here are the other general characteristics of the
noise:
>>
>> 1. The noise is loudest at idle
>> 2. Above idle, it sounds like a loose valve.
>> 3. While cruising, it can barely be heard, even when driving next to a
> concrete divider on the highway.
>> 4. After letting off the gas, the noise doesn't return until just above
> idle. It definitely doesn't start up right after getting off the throttle.
>> 5. It's clearly coming from the 3/4 side of the motor.
>> 6. All valves are correctly set, there's no excessive side play (solid
> rocker shafts), the springs are fine, etc. I've run the motor several
times
> with the valve cover off and everything looks right.
>> 7. After unplugging the spark plug wires at #3 and #4, it's clear that
the
> issue is at #3. With the #3 wire unplugged, the noise diminishes by a good
> 80%
>>
>> Here's a video (credit Sean) that does a great job of capturing the noise
>>
>> https://youtu.be/sxs1yrFLPl0
>>
>> I know what all of this suggests, but I'm curious if what I'm describing
> rings any other bells for anyone. Or, if we know what it is, can it be
fixed
> without splitting the case????
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Daniel
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
>> To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
>> http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
>> If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
> To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
> http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
> If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
> To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
> http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
> If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org
_______________________________________________
VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org



------------------------------

Subject: Digest Footer

_______________________________________________
VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
If you need more help, contact: gregm at vwtype3.org


------------------------------

End of type3-vwtype3.org Digest, Vol 84, Issue 7
************************************************
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.vwtype3.org/pipermail/type3-vwtype3.org/attachments/20170916/9f4a4329/attachment.htm>


More information about the type3-vwtype3.org mailing list