[T3] Fuel Pump Primer Switch

Wed Sep 26 17:53:16 PDT 2018

As the original, 1-owner of a 1969 Square, I can verify that it's MUCH
easier to have Jim's Fuel Pump Primer Switch installed than to replace a
"failed" ignition switch.

In 2012, we were going to tow our Square to Kimball, MI to have Bob do
extensive body work. 2 days before we planned to leave, the electrical
module of the Ignition Switch  (literally) disintegrated. Jim had to make
an "emergency house call" to install a new ignition switch.

After Jim had sufficient testing on his Fuel Pump Primer Switch, and felt
confident that it met his high standard for products which he sells, I had
him install his 3-position F.P.P.S.  It took no more than 15 minutes for
the install.

Now after ~45-seconds of running the F.P.P.S. the engine (almost always)
fires.
It really saves the "wear & tear" of the Ignition Switch.  And the security
of preventing potential "thieves" from being sucessful, is worth the
minimal  expense.

Gary

On Wednesday, September 26, 2018, <
type3-vwtype3.org-request at lists.vwtype3.org> wrote:

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> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Re: Fuel Primer Switch.... (J. Jonik)
>    2. Re: Fuel Primer Switch..... (Keith Park)
>    3. Re: Fuel Primer Switch.... (Jim Adney)
>    4. Re: Fuel Primer Switch..... (Jim Adney)
>    5. Re: Fuel Primer Switch..... (William Jahn)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Tue, 25 Sep 2018 20:56:30 +0000 (UTC)
> From: "J. Jonik" <j_jonik at yahoo.com>
> To: "type3 at vwtype3.org" <type3 at vwtype3.org>
> Subject: Re: [T3] Fuel Primer Switch....
> Message-ID: <796426625.2419402.1537908990693 at mail.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Car is a '71.? Did I say '73??? I'm pretty sure I have ignition switches
> from past cars ('72 and '73) in my collection...if necessary.? Whole
> steering columns, actually.? But, which ones are compatible with a '71?? I
> also have some pressure sensors.? Could a problem be with that?
> And, there's still the smell of gas in the car...with no leaks visible.
> Would a bad spark plug...not igniting the gas spray from injector...cause
> that?
> ?
>
> Subject: Re: [T3] Fuel Primer Switch.....Message-ID: <
> 5BAA3AE0.20841.2BA0D6A at jadney.vwtype3.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
>
> On 25 Sep 2018 at 5:33, J. Jonik wrote:
>
> > Why doesn't turning on the key multiple times, not to point of ignition,
> prime
> > the fuel system?
>
> Turning the key multiple times clearly works, but it adds wear to the
> ignition switch. That's not as much of a problem on your '73 as it
> would be on a '71, where a replacement switch is almost impossible to
> find, but even replacing a '73 switch is much more work and more
> expensive than a primer switch.
>
> I think it's also likely that having a switch that allows you to run
> the pump continuously, as opposed to a series of 1 second pulses, is
> more effective in clearing the air out of the fuel system.
>
> > Then, what's wrong that it NEEDS special priming tricks, or primer
> > switches?Is there an old, worn out, or dirty Primer Switch somewhere
> that ought
> > be replaced, or cleaned?
>
> That's the $64k question. I don't know. I've worried about that for
> decades and tried replacing everything in the system without
> discovering the key.
>
> The ONLY remaining suspect I have is the fact that when these systems
> were new, all the fuel lines in the engine compartment had grey vinyl
> covers over the gas lines. It's possible that this gave just enough
> extra heat shielding that the heating/boiling problem didn't occur.?
>
> Over time, as we replaced those hoses, those sheaths were discarded,
> because they were too hard to get over the new lines. Plus, most of
> the time the new lines were larger than the OE so it would have been
> impossible to slide the sheaths on.
>
> It's also possible that this problem always occurred in our hotter
> climates, and that it has gotten worse with global warming (yes, it's
> real) and possible changes in the vapor pressure of modern gasolines.
>
> I designed the primer switch kits to solve this very common problem
> simply and cheaply. They're effective and cheap. They work.
>
> --
> *******************************
> Jim Adney, jadney at vwtype3.org
> Madison, Wisconsin, USA
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Tue, 25 Sep 2018 20:14:44 -0400
> From: "Keith Park" <topnotch at nycap.rr.com>
> To: <type3 at vwtype3.org>
> Subject: Re: [T3] Fuel Primer Switch.....
> Message-ID:
>         <
> mailman.49640.1537920878.12170.type3-vwtype3.org at lists.vwtype3.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Your pressure regulator is no longer holding pressure,
> replace it and the problem goes away, however... there is no way to know
> if the replacement is good till you get it on there and adjusted.
>
> Jim's kits are an easy workaround for this.
>
> Keith
>
>
> Topnotch Restorations
> topnotch at nycap.rr.com
> http://www.topnotchresto.com
> 71 Squareback  ?Hothe?
> 65 Notchback  ?El Baja Rojo?
> 93 RX7  ?Redstur?
> 95 Chrysler Cirrus Lxi "Cirfogsalot"
> "hanging out at the tail end of the bell
> curve, and loving every minute of it!"
> -----Original Message-----
> From: type3-vwtype3.org [mailto:
> type3-vwtype3.org-bounces at lists.vwtype3.org]
> On Behalf Of J. Jonik
> Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2018 1:34 AM
> To: type3-vwtype3.org at lists.vwtype3.org
> Subject: Re: [T3] Fuel Primer Switch.....
>
> ?Why doesn't turning on the key multiple times, not to point of ignition,
> prime the fuel system?? Car starts on almost first, and a half, try when
> doing that.?? Then, what's wrong that it NEEDS special priming tricks, or
> primer switches?Is there an old, worn out, or dirty Primer Switch somewhere
> that ought be replaced, or cleaned?
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 26 Sep 2018 12:55:39 -0500
> From: "Jim Adney" <jadney at vwtype3.org>
> To: type3 at vwtype3.org
> Subject: Re: [T3] Fuel Primer Switch....
> Message-ID: <5BABC81B.2089.585509 at jadney.vwtype3.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> On 25 Sep 2018 at 20:56, J. Jonik wrote:
>
> > Car is a '71.? Did I say '73??? I'm pretty sure I have ignition
> > switches from past cars ('72 and '73) in my collection...if
> > necessary.? Whole steering columns, actually.? But, which ones are
> > compatible with a '71?? I also have some pressure sensors.? Could a
> > problem be with that?
>
> The '71 ignition switch is a one year only part. Nothing else works,
> unless you want to swap in the whole steering column from a '72 or 3,
> which is a WHOLE lot of work.
>
> Get the cheap primer switch, or make your own and quit agonizing over
> this!
>
> > And, there's still the smell of gas in the car...with no leaks
> > visible. Would a bad spark plug...not igniting the gas spray from
> > injector...cause that?
>
> Look around the injectors while the engine is running but not yet
> hot. If that's all dry, you probably have an exhaust leak at the
> lower heat exchanger, that you might be able to fix with some muffler
> putty.
>
> --
> *******************************
> Jim Adney, jadney at vwtype3.org
> Madison, Wisconsin, USA
> *******************************
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 26 Sep 2018 12:55:39 -0500
> From: "Jim Adney" <jadney at vwtype3.org>
> To: type3 at vwtype3.org
> Subject: Re: [T3] Fuel Primer Switch.....
> Message-ID: <5BABC81B.748.58545D at jadney.vwtype3.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
>
> On 25 Sep 2018 at 20:14, Keith Park wrote:
>
> > Your pressure regulator is no longer holding pressure,
> > replace it and the problem goes away, however... there is no way to know
> > if the replacement is good till you get it on there and adjusted.
>
> I doubt if it's the pressure regulator; Keith's the only one who's
> ever had problems with a pressure regulator. I know he's had 2 fail,
> but not in that way. The pressure regulators have a metal to metal
> valve/seat that should not change unless there's something in there
> that can rust. I cut one of Keith's apart just to see how they were
> made and they are pretty impressive.
>
> > Jim's kits are an easy workaround for this.
>
> Yes, you're making a very simple problem into a difficult one.
>
> --
> *******************************
> Jim Adney, jadney at vwtype3.org
> Madison, Wisconsin, USA
> *******************************
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 26 Sep 2018 13:02:10 -0700
> From: William Jahn <willjahn975 at gmail.com>
> To: "type3 at vwtype3.org" <type3 at vwtype3.org>
> Subject: Re: [T3] Fuel Primer Switch.....
> Message-ID: <5babe5c2.1c69fb81.75e0.62b9 at mx.google.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> I?ve seen inside an old one I cut apart . The metering plate and seat are
> metal , I would imagine over time and since this started not long after I
> was not driving the car very often the fuel has ethanol 10% that?s just
> sitting there which probably caused the metering plate and seat to rust
> enough . If I recall when there is no pressure from fuel the spring closes
> the metering plate on the seat . My main point is it might be rust /pitting
> that would cause the regulator to allow fuel to leak by .
>
>  I?m not about to rush out and buy a new one #1 because of the cost and #2
> who knows how long it sat on some shelf perhaps missing the caps or a cap
> then moisture would enter and the new one may not seal either.  Once it is
> primed it starts and even 10 hours later it will still start right up
> ,unless it sits over night and if a few days it needs more time running the
> pump to get the air out.
>
>  It?s the same issue with the battery. Within a 2 mile drive stop and go
> traffic I may start the car 4 times and since sitting in traffic you are
> running off the battery , in doing so the battery after a few times doing
> this does not fully charge. Plus now we had such a long HOT summer sitting
> in a hot garage only speeds up the normal self discharge rate . I wouldn?t
> think the 5 mA draw that VR has would do much even though I would prefer to
> not have any drain yet I have asked anyone who has the later electronic
> VR?s to check if it is normal , I don?t believe it is.
>
>  I recall last trip on the freeway watching the voltmeter I noticed when I
> did stop after 10 miles of steady driving the voltmeter at idle was 13
> volts when before it was below 12 volts.
>
> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>
> From: Jim Adney
> Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2018 10:55 AM
> To: type3 at vwtype3.org
> Subject: Re: [T3] Fuel Primer Switch.....
>
> On 25 Sep 2018 at 20:14, Keith Park wrote:
>
> > Your pressure regulator is no longer holding pressure,
> > replace it and the problem goes away, however... there is no way to know
> > if the replacement is good till you get it on there and adjusted.
>
> I doubt if it's the pressure regulator; Keith's the only one who's
> ever had problems with a pressure regulator. I know he's had 2 fail,
> but not in that way. The pressure regulators have a metal to metal
> valve/seat that should not change unless there's something in there
> that can rust. I cut one of Keith's apart just to see how they were
> made and they are pretty impressive.
>
> > Jim's kits are an easy workaround for this.
>
> Yes, you're making a very simple problem into a difficult one.
>
> --
> *******************************
> Jim Adney, jadney at vwtype3.org
> Madison, Wisconsin, USA
> *******************************
>
> _______________________________________________
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> To unsubscribe or change subscription options, visit:
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-- 
Gary "Frito" - '69 Squareback, FI, MT, One-owner
Rockport, TX (winter)
Lake Geneva, WI (summer)
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