[T3] type3-vwtype3.org Digest, Vol 45, Issue 7

Fiesta Cranberry fiestacranberry at gmail.com
Sun Jun 8 15:16:38 PDT 2014


OK, thanx.


On Sat, Jun 7, 2014 at 7:31 AM, <type3-vwtype3.org-request at lists.vwtype3.org
> wrote:

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> _______________________________________________
>
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Re: AAR Adjustment? (Max Welton)
>    2. more questions on The Baroness (Fiesta Cranberry)
>    3. Re: AAR Adjustment? (Daniel K. Du Vall)
>    4. Re: more questions on The Baroness (Daniel K. Du Vall)
>    5. sticky starter revealed. (Keith Park)
>    6. Re: more questions on The Baroness (Keith Park)
>    7. Re: more questions on The Baroness (Jim Adney)
>    8. Re: sticky starter revealed. (Soren Jacobsen)
>    9. Re: sticky starter revealed. (Brion Sabbatino)
>   10. Re: sticky starter revealed. (Dave Hall)
>   11. FI Dizzy for Carbs (Craigs List)
>   12. Re: sticky starter revealed. (Keith Park)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2014 15:17:23 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Max Welton <max_welton_2k at yahoo.com>
> To: type3 at vwtype3.org
> Subject: Re: [T3] AAR Adjustment?
> Message-ID:
>         <1402093043.44572.YahooMailBasic at web163903.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> http://www.maxwelton2k.net/squareback68/IMG_8159.jpg
>
> Darn. Ran out of hose.
>
> Guess I'll just HAVE to drive to the store. :-D
>
> Max Welton
> http://www.maxwelton2k.net/
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2014 16:14:44 -0700
> From: Fiesta Cranberry <fiestacranberry at gmail.com>
> To: Volkswagen <type3 at vwtype3.org>
> Subject: [T3] more questions on The Baroness
> Message-ID:
>         <CAD=
> 5u+JJRSnrWRkqTjZ5es6C72uJrCcQRoRBnfsdhhH8g1mysQ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Hi guys,
> I was just talking to my bf's coworker, who happens to be a VW nut.  He
> told me some interesting stuff.
>
> He says that if it is the camshaft, it may have been caused by a bad rebore
> of the case.  So, the case would have to be sent out and rebored again.  He
> thinks it would be better to buy a new block, instead of fixing what's in
> there.  What do you guys think about that?
>
> We haven't taken the engine out yet.  I need a place to stash The Baroness
> for a month while Lloyd works on the engine in my garage.
>
> Lori & The Baroness, '71 SB Automatic carbs
>
>
>
> --
> "I wrestled with reality for 36 years, and I'm happy to say I've finally
> won out over it."
>                                                   ---Elwood P. Dowd
> -------------- next part --------------
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2014 00:40:30 +0000
> From: "Daniel K. Du Vall" <dduvall at 1peter4-10.org>
> To: "type3 at vwtype3.org" <type3 at vwtype3.org>
> Subject: Re: [T3] AAR Adjustment?
> Message-ID:
>         <
> 64ddb3c2eeb142a3a087fa5520a9c934 at BY2PR05MB109.namprd05.prod.outlook.com>
>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Nice!
>
> Hmm something wrong with that picture ;-)
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: type3-vwtype3.org [mailto:
> type3-vwtype3.org-bounces at lists.vwtype3.org] On Behalf Of Max Welton
> Sent: Friday, June 06, 2014 5:17 PM
> To: type3 at vwtype3.org
> Subject: Re: [T3] AAR Adjustment?
>
> http://www.maxwelton2k.net/squareback68/IMG_8159.jpg
>
> Darn. Ran out of hose.
>
> Guess I'll just HAVE to drive to the store. :-D
>
> Max Welton
> http://www.maxwelton2k.net/
> _______________________________________________
> VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
> http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
> Contact gregm at vwtype3.org if you need help with the list.
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2014 00:43:59 +0000
> From: "Daniel K. Du Vall" <dduvall at 1peter4-10.org>
> To: "type3 at vwtype3.org" <type3 at vwtype3.org>
> Subject: Re: [T3] more questions on The Baroness
> Message-ID:
>         <
> 319d5f31ec7542ffbe9a2f227e912de6 at BY2PR05MB109.namprd05.prod.outlook.com>
>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Before jumping to any conclusions get the motor apart and have it
> inspected by someone in the know.  You will just drive yourself nuts
> speculating what's in there till you do.
>
> Daniel Du Vall
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: type3-vwtype3.org [mailto:
> type3-vwtype3.org-bounces at lists.vwtype3.org] On Behalf Of Fiesta Cranberry
> Sent: Friday, June 06, 2014 6:15 PM
> To: Volkswagen
> Subject: [T3] more questions on The Baroness
>
> Hi guys,
> I was just talking to my bf's coworker, who happens to be a VW nut.  He
> told me some interesting stuff.
>
> He says that if it is the camshaft, it may have been caused by a bad
> rebore of the case.  So, the case would have to be sent out and rebored
> again.  He thinks it would be better to buy a new block, instead of fixing
> what's in there.  What do you guys think about that?
>
> We haven't taken the engine out yet.  I need a place to stash The Baroness
> for a month while Lloyd works on the engine in my garage.
>
> Lori & The Baroness, '71 SB Automatic carbs
>
>
>
> --
> "I wrestled with reality for 36 years, and I'm happy to say I've finally
> won out over it."
>                                                   ---Elwood P. Dowd
> -------------- next part --------------
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> >
> _______________________________________________
> VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
> http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
> Contact gregm at vwtype3.org if you need help with the list.
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2014 21:34:49 -0400
> From: "Keith Park" <topnotch at nycap.rr.com>
> To: <type3 at vwtype3.org>
> Subject: [T3] sticky starter revealed.
> Message-ID: <45EBD4B8D90E4AACAF15C6B3179454C3 at NORM>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>
>
> A couple years ago I put a starter relay on he 71 because when the car was
> in hot soak it wouldn't engage.
>
> This solved that problem then it started sticking engaged, I did do some
> testing and eliminated the relay from the circuit and still had the problem
> but at some point the starter and solenoid got changed over too to no
> avail..  I finally had some time to noodle with it and swapped out the
> relay
> and walla!  No sticky starter but the engagement was slow.  I pulled apart
> the relay (old headlight relay with contacts paralleled) and found they
> were
> really whipped, not enough of a relay for this application.
>
>
>
> So I get an "Automotive" rated 50A relay (solenoid current is about 35A)
> from digikey, that works great. for TWO weeks, I got off the Northway on
> the
> way to the camp and stopped to answer nature's call  before I hit the bumpy
> dirt road with the trailer on there and ended up getting pissed twice, the
> second time with a NO start, no click, NOTHING.  Reached underneath (NEVER
> touch the starter without making damn sure its in Neutral and the E brake
> ON) and pulled the lead off the relay and put it back on the solenoid.  she
> starts!
>
>
>
> Pulled the relay apart. the spring material for the moving contact is spot
> welded in ONE spot to the top of the relay frame, that spot weld had
> failed,
> and what's worse is that failure mode can jamb your starter on without
> releasing it. I got lucky!  I took another one of these relays, (I never
> buy
> just one) and soldered the bloody thing on there so maybe now I can find
> the
> NEXT failure mode of this kind of relay but my warm N fuzzy is gone.
>  Anyone
> have a good proven source for high current relays in automotive
> applications?  Something ROBUST?  I really cant be having problems like
> this
> when the car and trailer are all stuffed and Im in the middle of nowhere.
>
>
>
> Keith
>
>
>
>
>
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2014 21:40:14 -0400
> From: "Keith Park" <topnotch at nycap.rr.com>
> To: <type3 at vwtype3.org>
> Subject: Re: [T3] more questions on The Baroness
> Message-ID: <C09BCF1399084506B63A1EC3D7281654 at NORM>
> Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="us-ascii"
>
> Doubtful,you'd hear the gear whine if they got the align bore off and your
> oil pressure would be in the toilet.  If you ran it without an oil with
> ZDDP
> in it, especially if you broke it in without the ZDDP that is likely what
> took out the cam, the other thing you need to do on startup is keep it
> running about 2500 RPM WITHOUT letting it idle to break in the cam.
>
> You should be able to see cam problems thru the sump though....
>
> Keith
>
>
> Top Notch Restorations
> topnotch at nycap.rr.com
> http://www.a383ina68.addr.com/radiorest/main.htm
> 71 Squareback "Hothe"
> 65 Notchback "El Baja Rojo"
> 65 Squareback "Eggcrate"
> 87 golf "Winterat"
> 93 RX7 "Redstur"
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: type3-vwtype3.org [mailto:
> type3-vwtype3.org-bounces at lists.vwtype3.org]
> On Behalf Of Fiesta Cranberry
> Sent: Friday, June 06, 2014 7:15 PM
> To: Volkswagen
> Subject: [T3] more questions on The Baroness
>
> Hi guys,
> I was just talking to my bf's coworker, who happens to be a VW nut.  He
> told me some interesting stuff.
>
> He says that if it is the camshaft, it may have been caused by a bad rebore
> of the case.  So, the case would have to be sent out and rebored again.  He
> thinks it would be better to buy a new block, instead of fixing what's in
> there.  What do you guys think about that?
>
> We haven't taken the engine out yet.  I need a place to stash The Baroness
> for a month while Lloyd works on the engine in my garage.
>
> Lori & The Baroness, '71 SB Automatic carbs
>
>
>
> --
> "I wrestled with reality for 36 years, and I'm happy to say I've finally
> won out over it."
>                                                   ---Elwood P. Dowd
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL:
> <
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> 4950e78/attachment.htm>
> _______________________________________________
> VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
> http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
> Contact gregm at vwtype3.org if you need help with the list.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Fri, 06 Jun 2014 21:51:39 -0500
> From: "Jim Adney" <jadney at vwtype3.org>
> To: type3 at vwtype3.org
> Subject: Re: [T3] more questions on The Baroness
> Message-ID: <53927E3B.22873.2E0862B at jadney.vwtype3.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
>
> On 6 Jun 2014 at 16:14, Fiesta Cranberry wrote:
>
> > He says that if it is the camshaft, it may have been caused by a bad
> rebore
> > of the case.  So, the case would have to be sent out and rebored again.
>  He
> > thinks it would be better to buy a new block, instead of fixing what's in
> > there.  What do you guys think about that?
>
> I think you need to examine what you find in there and consider all
> the possibilities. If the cam bearings are shot, then the case may be
> warped to the point where repair costs more than it's worth. If the
> bearings are fine, but the cam lobe is worn down, then I'd limit my
> thinking to bad cam/lifter problems.
>
> It's possible for the center web of the case to be pushed out,
> leaving a gap between the 2 sides of that web. That's the web that
> supports the #2 main bearing. That web also supplies oil from the
> left side of the case to the right, so a gap there will mean an
> almost complete loss of lubrication to the right side of the engine,
> along with low overall oil pressure everywhere else. If that web is
> warped, it CAN be repaired by RIMCO, but the cost mounts and it means
> new cam and main bearings. It's also possible that those oversize
> bearings are now impossible to find. If anyone has them RIMCO
> probably does. I've had this repair done, and it worked out okay, but
> I sold the car with that engine and don't know how well it faired
> over the long run.
>
> To check for this problem, take everything apart, remove all the
> bearing shells, and bolt the case halves together with just the 6
> main bearing studs, properly torqued. Reach in there and see if you
> can still slip a .002" feeler gauge between the 2 sides of the #2
> main bearing web, just above and below the crank bore. If the feeler
> gauge will slip in, the case is warped.
>
> The case RIMCO repaired for me had .020-.030" of gap there.
>
> --
> *******************************
> Jim Adney, jadney at vwtype3.org
> Madison, Wisconsin, USA
> *******************************
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2014 22:02:31 -0700
> From: Soren Jacobsen <snj at blef.org>
> To: type3 at vwtype3.org
> Subject: Re: [T3] sticky starter revealed.
> Message-ID: <EBFDCDD3-5BE6-448C-A1DA-221D06BB768C at blef.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> On Jun 6, 2014, at 6:34 PM, Keith Park <topnotch at nycap.rr.com> wrote:
>
> > So I get an "Automotive" rated 50A relay (solenoid current is about 35A)
> > from digikey, that works great. for TWO weeks, I got off the Northway on
> the
> > way to the camp and stopped to answer nature's call  before I hit the
> bumpy
> > dirt road with the trailer on there and ended up getting pissed twice,
> the
> > second time with a NO start, no click, NOTHING.  Reached underneath
> (NEVER
> > touch the starter without making damn sure its in Neutral and the E brake
> > ON) and pulled the lead off the relay and put it back on the solenoid.
>  she
> > starts!
> >
> > Pulled the relay apart. the spring material for the moving contact is
> spot
> > welded in ONE spot to the top of the relay frame, that spot weld had
> failed,
> > and what's worse is that failure mode can jamb your starter on without
> > releasing it. I got lucky!  I took another one of these relays, (I never
> buy
> > just one) and soldered the bloody thing on there so maybe now I can find
> the
> > NEXT failure mode of this kind of relay but my warm N fuzzy is gone.
>  Anyone
> > have a good proven source for high current relays in automotive
> > applications?  Something ROBUST?  I really cant be having problems like
> this
> > when the car and trailer are all stuffed and Im in the middle of nowhere.
>
> Yikes!  What specific relay is this so we know what to avoid?
>
> I've had good success with the Tyco 1432873-1, for 40A/6V applications
> (why anyone would want a VW new enough to feature a 12V electrical system
> from the factory is beyond me).
>
> Soren
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2014 23:22:12 -0600
> From: Brion Sabbatino <brionsab at msn.com>
> To: type3 <type3 at vwtype3.org>
> Subject: Re: [T3] sticky starter revealed.
> Message-ID: <BLU170-W115941E38DA452EC31DA28BCD2F0 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> I have had good luck using the Ford truck relay. Buy the best quality that
> NAPA sells. They seem to last me for many years.
> Brion SS. Utah
>
> > From: topnotch at nycap.rr.com
> > To: type3 at vwtype3.org
> > Date: Fri, 6 Jun 2014 21:34:49 -0400
> > Subject: [T3] sticky starter revealed.
> >
> >
> >
> > A couple years ago I put a starter relay on he 71 because when the car
> was
> > in hot soak it wouldn't engage.
> >
> > This solved that problem then it started sticking engaged, I did do some
> > testing and eliminated the relay from the circuit and still had the
> problem
> > but at some point the starter and solenoid got changed over too to no
> > avail..  I finally had some time to noodle with it and swapped out the
> relay
> > and walla!  No sticky starter but the engagement was slow.  I pulled
> apart
> > the relay (old headlight relay with contacts paralleled) and found they
> were
> > really whipped, not enough of a relay for this application.
> >
> >
> >
> > So I get an "Automotive" rated 50A relay (solenoid current is about 35A)
> > from digikey, that works great. for TWO weeks, I got off the Northway on
> the
> > way to the camp and stopped to answer nature's call  before I hit the
> bumpy
> > dirt road with the trailer on there and ended up getting pissed twice,
> the
> > second time with a NO start, no click, NOTHING.  Reached underneath
> (NEVER
> > touch the starter without making damn sure its in Neutral and the E brake
> > ON) and pulled the lead off the relay and put it back on the solenoid.
>  she
> > starts!
> >
> >
> >
> > Pulled the relay apart. the spring material for the moving contact is
> spot
> > welded in ONE spot to the top of the relay frame, that spot weld had
> failed,
> > and what's worse is that failure mode can jamb your starter on without
> > releasing it. I got lucky!  I took another one of these relays, (I never
> buy
> > just one) and soldered the bloody thing on there so maybe now I can find
> the
> > NEXT failure mode of this kind of relay but my warm N fuzzy is gone.
>  Anyone
> > have a good proven source for high current relays in automotive
> > applications?  Something ROBUST?  I really cant be having problems like
> this
> > when the car and trailer are all stuffed and Im in the middle of nowhere.
> >
> >
> >
> > Keith
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------- next part --------------
> > An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> > URL: <
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> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > VWType3.Org mailing list - type3 at vwtype3.org
> > http://lists.vwtype3.org/listinfo.cgi/type3-vwtype3.org
> > Contact gregm at vwtype3.org if you need help with the list.
>
> -------------- next part --------------
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 10
> Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2014 11:05:23 +0100
> From: "Dave Hall" <dave at hallvw.clara.co.uk>
> To: <type3 at vwtype3.org>
> Subject: Re: [T3] sticky starter revealed.
> Message-ID: <86C98B9F0C5C4F06A6DE2990D2CAC564 at DavidPC>
> Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="us-ascii"
>
> "I've had good success with the Tyco 1432873-1, for 40A/6V applications
> (why
> anyone would want a VW new enough to feature a 12V electrical system from
> the factory is beyond me).
>
> Soren "
>
> Probably just wants to drive it at night!  ;-)
>
> In all honesty, the upright Type 3 6V headlights were OK when they came
> out,
> and far superior to the symmetric 6V sloping Beetle ones of my '59, but
> that
> originally had 35/35W bulbs which aren't a match for higher powered ones
> with a twin relay.  The 180W generator back then limits the power available
> on a wet night though!
>
>
> Dave
> UK VW Tytpe 3&4 Club
> ====================
>
>
>
> ---
> This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus
> protection is active.
> http://www.avast.com
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 11
> Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2014 07:48:34 -0600
> From: Craigs List <craigslistcsprings at gmail.com>
> To: type3 at vwtype3.org
> Subject: [T3] FI Dizzy for Carbs
> Message-ID:
>         <CAF3AfUbqeuAAc=YSyoWeA2q00baJ6+3D0cXe_9115J+kW=
> DUqw at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> I'm back.......
>
> Mr Welton and I were discussing distributors last night. As of yesterday I
> got the new Dell 36's going on my squareback. Although they run better,I
> still have the stumble off of the line and a stumble at low rpm
> accreditation.
>
> When looking at the numbers on my dizzy I finally realized that I have a fi
> svda distributor. (Thanks Max) I was wondering what the differences between
> the fi distributor and a dizzy for carbs are? Is the curve different? Would
> funding a distributor designed for carbs help a lot, a little or would it
> be a waste of time?
>
> My current distributor is a 311 905 205 L. The charts say this is a svda
> off of a 1969 fi type 3. Through the recommendation of Mr. Welton, I gave
> it a little timing yesterday and this indeed helped.  I was short of time,
> so I just gave it a 1/4" counter clockwise turn to see what would happen.
> Today or tomorrow I am going to break out the gun and see where I am
> exactly. Timing instructions for this one are 0* at idle with the vacuum
> can capped.
>
> Any more pointers from you guys would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Adam
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 12
> Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2014 10:31:02 -0400
> From: "Keith Park" <topnotch at nycap.rr.com>
> To: <type3 at vwtype3.org>
> Subject: Re: [T3] sticky starter revealed.
> Message-ID: <1D8F71EFEBEF41D88577FEF10CA16CCA at NORM>
> Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="us-ascii"
>
> Digikey Z-2716-ND
>
> Keith
>
>
> Top Notch Restorations
> topnotch at nycap.rr.com
> http://www.a383ina68.addr.com/radiorest/main.htm
> 71 Squareback "Hothe"
> 65 Notchback "El Baja Rojo"
> 65 Squareback "Eggcrate"
> 87 golf "Winterat"
> 93 RX7 "Redstur"
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: type3-vwtype3.org [mailto:
> type3-vwtype3.org-bounces at lists.vwtype3.org]
> On Behalf Of Soren Jacobsen
> Sent: Saturday, June 07, 2014 1:03 AM
> To: type3 at vwtype3.org
> Subject: Re: [T3] sticky starter revealed.
>
> On Jun 6, 2014, at 6:34 PM, Keith Park <topnotch at nycap.rr.com> wrote:
>
> > So I get an "Automotive" rated 50A relay (solenoid current is about 35A)
> > from digikey, that works great. for TWO weeks, I got off the Northway on
> the
> > way to the camp and stopped to answer nature's call  before I hit the
> bumpy
> > dirt road with the trailer on there and ended up getting pissed twice,
> the
> > second time with a NO start, no click, NOTHING.  Reached underneath
> (NEVER
> > touch the starter without making damn sure its in Neutral and the E brake
> > ON) and pulled the lead off the relay and put it back on the solenoid.
> she
> > starts!
> >
> > Pulled the relay apart. the spring material for the moving contact is
> spot
> > welded in ONE spot to the top of the relay frame, that spot weld had
> failed,
> > and what's worse is that failure mode can jamb your starter on without
> > releasing it. I got lucky!  I took another one of these relays, (I never
> buy
> > just one) and soldered the bloody thing on there so maybe now I can find
> the
> > NEXT failure mode of this kind of relay but my warm N fuzzy is gone.
> Anyone
> > have a good proven source for high current relays in automotive
> > applications?  Something ROBUST?  I really cant be having problems like
> this
> > when the car and trailer are all stuffed and Im in the middle of nowhere.
>
> Yikes!  What specific relay is this so we know what to avoid?
>
> I've had good success with the Tyco 1432873-1, for 40A/6V applications (why
> anyone would want a VW new enough to feature a 12V electrical system from
> the factory is beyond me).
>
> Soren
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>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Subject: Digest Footer
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> ------------------------------
>
> End of type3-vwtype3.org Digest, Vol 45, Issue 7
> ************************************************
>



-- 
"I wrestled with reality for 36 years, and I'm happy to say I've finally
won out over it."
                                                  ---Elwood P. Dowd
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